Is Motorcycling Becoming More Tribal?
Good article and an important topic. When riding down the highway on my KTM 640, it’s the cruiser type riders that are the least likely to wave or acknowledge my passing. It’s been like that ever since I started riding 20 years ago. It’s normal to be more vested in the type of riding we do but it is troubling if people start being more disrespectful in tone. I think part of the negativity just comes from us liking our type of biking and riding more because it suited us. We don’t think enough about different people having different desires, abilities and biking interests. I think more people simply need to kindly point out to naysayers that they have the common interest of bikes and riding but have different interests and abilities. Remind them kindly that over time and a lifetime that riding interests also often change. Calling people out but in a kind and thoughtful way that helps these people reflect on it without becoming defensive. I know I’d like to be kindly reminded if I get off track. Thanks for sharing that article. Keep spreading the news and encouraging others to celebrate the differences as well as remind one another what what we have in common.
In the real world / meatspace - I don't think so - it's always been so.
It's just that internet forums like ADV allow members with low EQ to be bigots in public annonymously. That spreads the herd mentality.
I stopped taking anything on forums seriously a very long time ago. Turn the computer off/log out for a month and balance will be restored.
Great article and you got a lot of discussion. One thing I wonder is whether the moderation on these articles is as good as it is in Ride Reports. Rick has been moderating Ride Reports with an iron fist forever and doesn't allow any crap. For as long as he's been there I've gotten the PMs to complain that he can be too overmoderating, but on the other hand whenever I talk to the average inmate, they say that's the best sub on the site.
I notice some of the best subreddits have very strict rulz.
I was reading something the other day that said arguments back and forth increase the popularity of posts or threads or stories. It would therefore follow that companies would like increased posts or comments and therefore have less interest in reducing the inaccurate or provoking posts that may be inflammatory. This would apply more so social media than say a motorcycle thread I’m guessing. What do you think?
I can't speak for ADVRider when about whether arguments back and forth are a good or bad thing. From my perspective, arguments can get people to think about different viewpoints and perhaps spread some understanding that may not have previously existed. In my mind, the issue is whether the arguments are made with civility and facts.
I recognize that some publications, media outlooks and networks like to have inflammatory and accusatory comments. For some reason, that kind of drama is more popular now than ever.
Some people think it's wonderful. They want to create drama and see it. Especially drama from the lowest levels. And, I'm sure that kind of crap drama increases clicks, viewership and advertising dollars from companies that thrive on that sort of nonsense. Again, I don't think that ADVRider is that kind of media outlet.
It's troubling to me that that "troll" type activity is on the significant uptick. I think ADVRider's content on both the front page and in the forum is almost always thoughtful. It's that some of the readers' comments aren't. And, that's sad.
Who would have thought a few years back that people would spend a significant amount of time writing stuff to purposely make people angry or sad; for the attention and/or FOR FUN! I don't get it. But then again, I'm now what some people would call an old fart.
For me, ADVRider has been a wonderful break from all that noise which I consider to be garbage of the worst kind. That's what troubles me when I see the above type crap written in a community that I love and enjoy.
So sure, there are outlets that write, sell and want crap. And there are people that love that kind of thing. I am just hoping that those people are not the preponderance of the motorcycling community.
I've noticed this back in the mid 00's when I started riding on the street through my 3 bikes. I started with a CBR600F3 and would get a lot of waves and talk from sportbike riders but not much beyond that since it was mostly that or Harley's around me with ADV just starting to catch on.
My next bike was a CBR1100XX and I noticed right away that a lot more Harley people waved and would come up to talk about it.
Then came the V-Strom and pretty much everyone waved and I had a lot of people asking me about how it rode around Boston VS other bikes. So viewing people differently based on their bike has definitely been there for awhile and if there's been any change maybe it's just that ADV is big enough to be its own insular group now instead of this random off shoot which took in a bit from everyone else. With enough popularity and the internet you'll sadly get that kinda stuff.
As to GS's and Starbucks what can I say, they make a great table for your venti oat milk mocha latte.
Now that I'm doing some live streams with people like Itchy Boots on YouTube, I'm seeing a fair amount of trolling in the comments.
I always think back to 1991 when I was at NeXT, Steve Jobs' computer company that he started after leaving Apple, and our efforts to open the Internet to the public. Tim Berners Lee had written the first web browser, I got to have him demo it to Steve, and we wondered what it would bring.
We were convinced that it would usher in an era of enlightenment just like the printing press did. Scientists who had been using the Internet for a decade could now enlighten us all.
But I think the exact opposite happened. You never see a scientist wade into a discussion about vaccines or masks. They will broadcast, like they can do with a tweet or YouTube, but they don't read the responses or engage in them. Instead, nation states, political groups, and people who could make money by trolling, drowned out and chased off reasonable voices in places like Facebook Groups, enabling conspiracies to take flight.
I read the article, and then read the comments and was looking for the obvious TLDR crowd to pop up and troll, and they sure as shit did. It's a growing issue for sure but I'll drop a video below and watch it ALL, Gary Vee makes a solid response to this and strangely this is one of his least watched videos.
I hate trolls, I respond to them on occasion, even though you shouldn't feed them, but usually there is a deep issue with them, and they are lashing out, it's not about your subject matter
Get past the subject you are talking about be it motorcycles, knitting, baseball etc. are they hitting out at you or comparing themselves to you.
Get them to move on by making them back off and call them out...it's usually jealousy, acknowledge that then they have lost their force, they have nothing left other than bullshit responses.
...but be aware that negative troll comments are good to read once you get past it rubbing you the wrong way just like the polar opposite, positive compliments, they aren't always right either.
Have a watch...4 minutes
Now if you watch Gary and say I can't do that!?
Then watch this, and send the trolls a link to this video and tell them how great they are and you loved their video (this video), and if it isn't them you apologise because that's how they come across!
My father loved to troll my sisters and I growing up and it made my sisters crazy. They have never been able to let it go.
For me, I would laugh along with him and quickly admit something like "yeah, I'm white so I can't jump." It would completely disarmed him. No fun to troll someone who can just shrug it off or laugh along with it.
On ADV, I have a few people who follow me around and send me PMs about how awful a person I am and like Gary Vee, I wonder what situation they're in that makes them feel that way. I try to listen and empathize, but some people just can't control their rage no matter what.
Starting the scooter forum on ADV caused some inmates to lose their minds and they've never been willing to talk to me since.
John Oliver addresses Conspiracy Theorists in his show this week.
He's funny and informative with great explanations as to why they occur - but I couldn't watch all of it. The people-stupid is just too f@cking depressing.
Things are going to be a lot different when I'm in charge. Think Sparta.
Starting the scooter forum on ADV caused some inmates to lose their minds and they've never been willing to talk to me since.
Sounds like you're way ahead on the deal.
Things are going to be a lot different when I'm in charge. Think Sparta.
Wow. Just wow!
..and so he rode away on a potato eating, superb white horse.
My father just beat me occasionally, when he was in the mood. I was supposed to know why, because I always did something wrong! Trolls don't bother me in the least bit! They're just kinda full of sh*** but real easy to spot. I like toying with some of 'em.
Excellent article. I actually got into motorcycles to be alone. I've avoided being part of large groups that organize rides or just try to make a community of out it. It's a great thing to do I am sure. It's just not why I got into it.
I ride when I want to be alone. I often ride not having fixed a destination/schedule and try to get as far away from civilization and traffic as I can.
So I am probably not the best judge of the culture surrounding this. But I did want to share my experience of meeting bikers in real life. It's been at some far removed cafe out in the middle of nowhere. And there is instant respect and cordiality. I've had help from some of then when I had engine trouble trying to wade through water.
I've also closed business deals across the table when we both realized we were into motorcycles. It's a bond that's instantaneous and people around the table don't fully understand.
So my own personal experience has been quite limited, but very positive.
